SHOWNOTES
https://blog.hubspot.com/marketing/gen-z-myths?utm_campaign=Marketing%20Blog%20-%20Daily%20Emails&utm_medium=email&utm_content=223400490&utm_source=hs_email

TIMECODES
00:00-00:35 Myths about Generation Z
00:35-3:34 Why do we keep focusing on Gen Z?
3:34-6:04 Myth 1: Gen Z is obsessed with fast fashion
6:04-8:22 Myth 2: Data and Privacy are irrelevant to Gen Z
8:22-10:43 Myth 3: TikTok is the best place to reach Gen Z
10:43-14:51 Myth 4: Put a product in front of Gen Z and they will buy it
14:51-17:15 Outro

TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01):
What's up everybody and welcome to another episode of the hybrid ministry podcast, solo pod this morning. Uh, I mentioned several weeks back, uh, that I had just given notice to my church. Um, and so I'm kind of in a little bit of a transition. And so I'm from church and Chicago to a church in, uh, Dallas, Texas. And so got weird travel schedule going on. So me and Matt's, uh, schedule is having a hard time lining up. So, uh, today I just wanted to chat through just a quick couple of generation Z. Um, miss, uh, and the first thing I wanted to do with that is, uh, I pulled this article from a HubSpot article. I'll link it in the show notes, super interesting. And obviously HubSpot is not a Christian company. And so they're focused more on marketing than they are, you know, like on the church or whatever.

Nick Clason (00:53):
Uh, but what I wanted to say was I wanted to say, why, why do we keep honing in on gen Z? Um, I think, uh, I've just had like a, I don't know, a realization over the last little bit that like churches are, um, built, I think for, for older generations, you know, they're, they're, they're doing it the way, um, it's always been done. Um, and I think that there is probably a rethink that needs to take place. And I think that when you say that to, to maybe some older generations, gen X, um, boomer, there's just an immediate knee jerk of like, you know, you can't get rid of this, you can't get rid of that. Maybe the Sunday morning se sermon, um, the way we dress, the way we do things like, and I get that, right. There's a, there's a safety and a comfort in, um, just the traditions and the habits that have been built.

Nick Clason (01:47):
But I think gen Z is actually a really interesting case study because, and the reason I think it's important is because I don't know that the church is being super, um, relevant to reach them. I think that the church is doing things the way it's always been done. I think you look across the landscape of, uh, church leadership. The majority of church leaders are older in their forties, fifties, some even in their sixties. Um, and you know, like you, you hate to like categorize anybody, but they may just be kinda like hanging on until retirement. And so are they really looking to innovate? Are they really looking to reach and like, sure they're looking to reach, um, but maybe they're trying to do so in such a way that is done, um, reaching people the way that, that, that they're used to reaching it and the type of model that they're built. And so the reason we keep honing in, at least I keep honing in on gen Z. First of all, like I've said before, I am a youth pastor. So that is, you know, immediately in my kinda like purview. But the second thing is I think the church needs to adapt, not because to try and reach a specific generation, but because them millennials as well and all the generations that are gonna

Nick Clason (02:58):
Come after gen Z are gonna be different. So how can the church, which is in my personal and theological opinion, the most relevant institution in the world, it is the one that has stood the test of time. And so this isn't me coming in and just like slinging mud at the church. It's me, um, caring deeply about the church and how do we help take it to what could be the next level. And so, um, just one this article, like I said, okay, so we're gonna kind of dive into this article, um, is five, five gen Z myths debunked. Um, and so the first one, it says gen Z is obsessed with fast fashion. All right. So obviously as a church, we don't give a ton of care to fashion or apparel or they're pur purchasing things. However, um, you know, I think that the, the, the thing that is interesting to pull kind of out of this point here is that they're saying that they're interested in fast fashion.

Nick Clason (03:56):
That is a myth. Um, and it's not just about what's cheapest because as I'm looking at a graph that they share question here says, does gen Z think companies should take a stance on social issues? Uh, 50% of gen Z say yes, where 26% say no, and then 24% say not sure. And I think that that piece right there is incredibly relevant for the church, because I think oftentimes as a church, we, uh, hold back our opinions because we're afraid, uh, to ostracize anybody. And I understand it and I get the notion of it. I get the importance of staying in the middle. Uh, but the people, especially the younger people that we're serving, they wanna know where we stand on things. They want us to take a stance. And that's difficult, I think, as a church because, you know, uh, gen Z tends to skew maybe a little bit more left and our church tends to skew maybe a little bit more, right.

Nick Clason (04:51):
If we're just speaking politically. And so how do you take a stance on what I think is most important is to take a stance the way that Jesus would take a stance. Uh, but that can be challenging, cuz that might go against either a, a gen Z type person or B, it might go against, uh, the rest of your church or their, their older framework. So how is the church? Do you have the courage to stand up and to take the stances that you need to take the, and the stances that matter to gen Z? Um, and I think perhaps the reason that we pull back on that as a church is because our church's stance coming from maybe a little more conservative position is gonna go against a little more liberal of a position of, uh, what gen Z you know, uh, typically cares about the final paragraph, right? Just to kind of highlight that the final paragraph of this, um, this first point says we, when we ask gen Zers who want companies to take a stance on which issues and which are most important to them, racial justice was by far the top at 69% followed by LGBTQ plus rights, 50% gender inequality, 46 and climate change,

Nick Clason (05:57):

1. So again, just to highlight the things that gen Z is saying is the most important thing for them. Uh, the second thing here, the second myth that is debunked is that data, privacy and security are irrelevant for gen Z. And so again, they're saying that that's a myth, right? Because you know, it says here this first paragraph, I get why many people believe this one gen Z's known for being glued to their phones, which obviously comes with the risk of unsecured and unrestricted data. Right? However, it actually is the kind of the opposite. So gen Z's looking for data security, they want that to matter. So as a church, as you're creating more, maybe hybrid opportunities online giving, um, collecting their data, how are you, um, how are you, uh, keeping track of their data and how are you ensuring that it's it's safe, right?

Nick Clason (06:47):
Uh, furthermore, it goes on to share graph and it says, uh, gen Z's more likely to purchase from brands that number one treat their employees. Well, that's at 84% that they can trust with their data as high as 83%, um, donate to a, a portion of their profits to charity 68% actively try to reduce the environmental impact. 60% are committed to diversity and inclusion. 53% and advocate for racial justice. 51% are small businesses. 46% advocate for gender equality. 42% are owned by a person of color. 39% are owned by a member of LGBTQ. Plus 38% are woman owned, 37% and advocate for LGBTQ rights, 37%. So as you can see, the purchase decisions are strongly influenced by whether or not they can trust a company with their data, second ranked highest, but also the care about the, the issues like the, the social issues. And they're looking for those things, they care about those things.

Nick Clason (07:42):
And so they're gonna trust and subsequently not trust institutions that, um, that care about the things that they care about and the church we're an institution, just, we are, we're a large institution. I know we're not really a family and it should be different. And once you get into a church, I think you typically find that in most churches, especially the ones that are healthy, um, but from an outsider, especially a gen Z outsider, looking in, they're gonna look at that institution and they're gonna have some pause. They're gonna be concerned, you know, about a couple of things. Um, and as a church, how do we, how do we best make a bridge towards them? Okay. The third myth to debunk and this, listen, this is something we've talked about in this podcast. A billion times, TikTok is the best way to reach gen Z. All right. So check out what this first paragraph here says. This is a TikTok is obviously a great space for gen Z. It offers a genuine feel to the content that no other app provides. The style is quite attractive for some of our shorter attention spans and busy schedules. And in fact, 10 TikTok is the app that gen Z uses most often, despite this surprisingly, or maybe not. It is not our favorite social media platform when

Nick Clason (08:54):
Asked gen Z of their favorite social media app, Instagram and YouTube easily took the cake with TikTok being placed as third. So Instagram was 27%. YouTube was 23%. TikTok was 14% Facebook, 11% Snapchat, 10%. So again, we've been talking about short form video content, and I, we still think that that is king and we also have never advocated against YouTube, um, and Instagram. And so, um, especially Instagram with the, with the big push that they have right now towards reals. And so TikTok, uh, obviously is short form video content. And I think TikTok has pushed other platforms to kind of invest in that and make that more of a priority. And so how can you do that? What can you be pushing towards in that way? Um, but also, uh, Matt said this a couple weeks ago, too. Um, he said, once you reach someone with, with a TikTok video, like, yeah, that's great.

Nick Clason (09:48):
And all, uh, but then like, what do you, um, how do you sell them? Like, what's the next step? What's the conversion that takes place? Cause talk's a lot more just about discovery. So you discover something, but like even when you follow people on TikTok, it doesn't necessarily show them. Cuz I think majority of people spend their time on their four up page. And so you may gain a bunch of followers on TikTok, but are you showing up regularly in other people's algorithms and then thus right as a marketer, how then do you, uh, convert that into something that's actually meaningful into getting their information as a church? Um, if you're a marketer into getting their information so that you can sell them something that's a much, a much tougher sell, especially on something like TikTok. And so it's actually beneficial and advantageous to us that that Instagram and YouTube are still higher, that we can still invest in those platforms just as, as equally.

Nick Clason (10:43):
All right. The fourth myth here put a product in front of gen Z and they will buy it. So it says even though they gravitate towards TikTok style content doesn't mean they're receptive to just any form of short form video. Um, subsequently it says how, you know, how does gen Z prefer to discover new products on social media? Uh, 41% says through short form video. So again, that underscores what we've been saying, 36 through ads or sponsored content 32 through a feed post 29 through social media shops where purchase app happens through a story post, uh, 25% and then through an influencer 25%. All right. And so basically they there's, they just, just prefer to discover things maybe through TikTok reels or other short form videos. Um, but they don't want to imposed on them. Right. And so, uh, it actually, it goes on to say here in a world where we often feel are made to feel powerless, we strongly value a sense of autonomy and agency help us feel empowered through your actions.

Nick Clason (11:45):
So think about that as a church, um, we're pushing something, um, we're not selling anything, right. Um, but, but there is a level of decision that needs to be made specifically with regards to Jesus and with regards to the gospel. So how do we put the agency back in the hands of the people that we're trying to reach? Um, and a message, right. John 14, six, I am the way the truth and the life, the the is a very exclusive article there. Um, meaning that Jesus is putting and positioning himself as the person of the foremost authority. He is the way to the father. So how do we communicate that message in a culture? Um, and to a generation that they don't wanna be told what to believe. They don't wanna be told what to do. They wanna make the decision for themselves. They wanna be given the options.

Nick Clason (12:37):
And then they want to look around, see what their friends are thinking, um, or come to those decisions. So how do we as a church position and posture ourselves to not make it all about us, but instead to make it about the students that we are reaching. Okay. Um, and then the fifth myth here, um, word of mouth is a great way to reach gen Z, right? And I know that this one might seem contradictory. Um, but gen Z is feeling stressed outta control, doomed, like the weight of the world lies on their shoulders. And so with all this marketing that comes at them, um, we've turned, uh, what we wanna do is we wanna, um, everybody wants to put and push. Um, everybody wants to put and push an agenda, right? But like what's, what's most important, I think is still the human to human connection.

Nick Clason (13:25):
And obviously here we are, right. We're a, a podcast talking about the way to do ministry in a hybrid way, but there's still something about that human to human connection. And they still care about what other people say. Right. I use a lawn care company based on a recommendation. I use a plumber based on a recommendation. I feel better about things based on a recommendation than, um, a bunch of things on Google. And if I don't have that right, I then will go to Google or go to Yelp and look at reviews. Okay. So, uh, this graph here under this, this myth here, what channels have gen Z discovered new products on in the past three months? So 57% through social media, 46% through YouTube ad 42% by searching the internet 36 in retail stores, 30 by word of mouth, 23 through ads on film, TV, uh, streaming 19 through television, and then 19 through ads on music streaming like Pandora, SoundCloud, Spotify.

Nick Clason (14:19):
So, uh, the marketing, what this is saying, right? The marketing into gen Z spaces is that they feel comfortable on social media. Um, and that's the places that they're looking. And so, you know, even like I was saying, word of mouth, it's still, it's still value. It's still important. Um, what if your word of mouth can also underscore and come alongside of some of your online things? What if it can come alongside of some of the ads that, that they're seeing, cuz that's where they're, they're discovering the, the majority of what they, um, are, are buying and what they're purchasing.

Nick Clason (14:51):
So, Hey, listen guys, again, appreciate you for being here. Uh, sorry for the, the format. Sorry. Matt's not on. Um, but uh, just, I read the article. I found it super interesting and thought, man, there's a lot of like implications for the church. Um, we are, we're moving into a different age and you know, I think that the church is, I mean, I don't think I know that the church, uh, will prevail. It always has. It always will. Um, but the generations behind it are less and less, um, interested in just, uh, buying into it, hook, line and sinker. And so how do we as churches, position, posture, ourselves to make, to make the most effective impact in the lives of generations, these students, because before we know it, they're gonna be the ones that are in their twenties and then thirties and forties, and they're gonna be the ones in our churches.

Nick Clason (15:41):
And so we can't just keep doing things the way that we've always been doing it. Digital is incredibly important to them and the lifestyle that they're living. So how do we, as a church also find ourselves into their lives through digital means through marketing, through advertising now because we're trying to market Jesus, but because we're trying to, to reach people who are far from him and who are spending their time on these types of platforms and in these types of spaces and are becoming more and more comfortable with it. And just because they're comfortable with it and we may be less and less comfortable or even frankly uncomfortable with it, uh, doesn't mean we shouldn't, uh, force ourselves to, to figure it out and learn it and work through it. So thank you guys again for hanging out. Give us a like a subscribe. I mean, we would love to hear from you, um, from a, a review, just pull, open your purple podcast app on your iPhone and leave us a five star review, um, and a rating that would be incredible.

Nick Clason (16:43):
We are online at [hybridministry.xyz](hybridministry.xyz) and on Twitter at hybrid ministry. Look forward to connecting with you there. Hey, listen, like I said, I am in the middle of a little bit of a transition once things get settled a little bit, um, look for quite a bit more resources information, um, uh, you know, downloadables freebie stuff that we're gonna be given away, uh, really looking forward to growing and expanding the community and our reach here on this podcast. So again, thanks for hanging with us and we will talk to you next time.

SHOW NOTES
//VIDEO TUTORIALS ON RUNNING ADS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dymukpfbg4A
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bGl8B_PO_Ow&t=106s

//ADDING YOUR FACEBOOK PIXEL TO YOUR WEBSITE
https://www.facebook.com/business/help/952192354843755?id=1205376682832142

TIMECODES
00:00-01:04 Introduction
01:04-03:09 The purpose of online advertising
03:09-06:39 TikTok and Google Ads
06:39-07:10 Step 1 - Set up a Business Account on Facebook
07:10-10:19 Step 2 - Gather Content and Determine Time Margin
10:19-10:51 Step 3 - Clarify your win
10:51-11:31 Step 4- Run the Ad
11:31-12:07 Step 5 - 3 Questions: Target, Budget, & Goal
12:07-15:46 Step 6 - Create your Audience (MOST IMPORTANT!!)
15:46-18:15 Step 7 - Time to get creative!
18:15-21:34 When to hit the eject button on a bad ad
21:34-22:43 What is next?
22:43-26:55 How to retarget warmer leads?
26:55-28:42 Go do it!

TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01):
What's up everybody. Welcome to another episode of the hybrid ministry podcast. Your host this morning, Nick Clason, alongside the baby holding Matt Johnson. Good morning, Matt. Are you awake?

Matt Johnson (00:14):
Good morning. I am. Uh, I'm awake. I got the baby in my hands right now. She, uh, she's mom that I have a little bit break. Cause I heard her crying and I went, ran and grab her. So if you hear her, I'm sorry, but she has a pleasure. I hope, she won't cry. She's just gonna grunt a lot.

Nick Clason (00:31):
Just making grunty noises. And even if she does cry, I will do my best to fill the gap, but it's gonna be hard cuz I don't actually know what we're talking about today. This is all you so on, on today's episode, what I actually wanted to do is I wanted to talk to Matt about advertising, digital advertising. How do we do it? How do you set it up and maybe have him walk us through a little bit of what that process looks like. It can get a little bit tricky, a little bit confusing. So before anything like Matt, what are, what is the purpose of online advertising? Can you walk us through some of the examples or some of the reasons why you would even want to run an ad in the first place?

Matt Johnson (01:14):
Yeah, absolutely. So there, when it comes to like Facebook ads or ads in general, um, a lot of people say, oh, the purpose is to like, uh, tell you what my product is. Right? Um, so it's to bring awareness, but there is actually three main purposes for tra uh, your ads, which is awareness, consideration, and conversion. And we can really get into the differences of all those. But honestly, awareness is like, let's bring awareness for, um, you know, whatever we're trying to promote. So in this context would be your church consideration would be, you know, I'm trying to get people to like engage with us, maybe watch video, send traffic to our website, download an app, give us their email, that kinda thing. And then the conversion ad is like, Hey, I want you to buy this shirt or I want you to buy our, you know, maybe your vacation Bible school ticket or whatever that looks like. So those are gonna be a three main ads. And we're talking about ads, we'll talk about how each of those should play into each other and how this creates like this robust system for you.

Nick Clason (02:30):
Okay. So you would recommend doing an ad, like a, like a three tiered three prong, add one for awareness, one for consideration, one for conversion and have them all kind of like work together

Matt Johnson (02:43):
In a perfect marketing plan. Yes. But that's not necessarily what I'm gonna recommend for most people. Like we don't even do that at currently where we're at. So yeah. Um, uh, we mostly run awareness ads what we're trying to do, but then like, okay, we have our vacation Bible school coming up, so let's, you know, get our conversion up for that kinda stuff. But I can, we can go into like how we want those to play off of each other here in a second.

Nick Clason (03:09):
So, so today we're gonna focus particularly and specifically on Facebook. Um, I'm assuming, right?

Matt Johnson (03:17):
Yeah. We can talk a little bit about TikTok and Google, um, which are, those are probably gonna be your three main, you could also do LinkedIn, but most ad functionality is very slim to whatever we talk about. So Facebook is the easiest starting point for everyone here, Google you're, um, ads, which super easy, but that's how you see those Google ads. Like if you search something and it's the top thing, uh, like, oh, uh, for this SEO yeah. Functionality or on a YouTube ad, that's how you're gonna run those and then TikTok or, you know, just a normal ad, but they run almost exactly like a Facebook ad and LinkedIn ads are the same way. And I can know in the difference of like, why you'd wanna use one of those over the other two.

Nick Clason (04:03):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, well, I here's the thing, I know that there's been a couple different times where I've tried to run an ad. Um, mm-hmm and I'm pretty much an idiot. And you told me about six months ago to run a TikTok ad. So I did, so I started the TikTok ad account. I did all the things, I filmed the video and then I violated some community guideline that I didn't even know. I, I violated. And so they like blacklisted my video and then I was just stuck. And even when I asked you for help, you're like, well, I can't remember what you said, but like I think I reached out to 'em and they didn't answer me um,

Matt Johnson (04:45):
Yeah, it's usually step one is reaching out. Um, TikTok could have, my guess is TikTok is cuz it was a religious ad.

Nick Clason (04:55):
Mm yeah. And well, the point, my point in saying all that is like, I just, I felt so like over my head, like right. I was just waiting into like something I never really waited into. And so it just felt, uh, if it can feel really intimidating. And so yeah, I was hoping that kind of through this, um, we could look at just a step by step ad building framework. Um, but I wanted to start there because right. The idea, I think a lot of churches, if they're like, oh, we should run an ad. Why to get more people here. Right. Um, while that might be an option or a solution to what is about to happen. Um, I think that there needs to be a little bit more of a dynamic and a little bit more of a robust why, um, understanding that there are different avenues to it.

Nick Clason (05:46):
There are the three different, there's the awareness, there's a consideration and there's the conversion. And so the purpose of your ad is important. It's good to define that and know the reason why you're doing it and know mm-hmm, that running an ad and anything like digital marketing online is gonna take time. And so you may not have one week, a hundred people in your church and the next week a thousand people in your church, you're probably gonna have to build to that. And that's where like the, the purpose of ad running is that it, it slowly builds that that brand awareness and equity over time. Um, at least that sounds good to me. And so I'm just saying all that stuff. And so hopefully you agree. And if I said something I shouldn't, you'll just you'll tell me I'm wrong.

Matt Johnson (06:31):
Yeah. Yep. No, you're good. Keep going.

Nick Clason (06:33):
So let's talk about it then. That's all I got. So let's talk about it then let's, uh, dive in. If you are brand new, like you have a Facebook page, um, for your church, um, let's assume that that's the starting spot then. Where do you go?

Matt Johnson (06:50):
Yeah. So the thing is you gotta set up a business account on Facebook. So you go, if you type in business.facebook.com, you can set up your ads account and that's how you're gonna set up your ads account. But before anyone listening to this runs an ad, I want you to ask yourself two questions. How much content do I have and what is my margin of time? And the reason I say that is cuz when we start talking about ads and how to really do ads, well, you're gonna a lot of time and a lot. It's really just ad, which is what

Nick Clason (07:27):
Like a one single ad one campaign. Yeah,

Matt Johnson (07:30):
Yeah. Which our church used to do all the time. But our conversion numbers on that where we're like 14 for, or, you know, uh, $6 for a lead. If I'm on that's bad. If I'm, yeah. If I'm over $4 a lead, I feel like a failure. Um, cause it's a waste of money honestly. And like we got our ads now to 39 cents a lead, so wow. Uh, which, you know, like that's very rare that you hit that. And honestly, we got really lucky and it's all got in that, but like that's the, but it took a lot of time, a lot of new content, a lot of new strategy for that. So if you're just like, Hey, I just wanna run one ad kind of targeted here. I have this much money. My recommendation was to would to be just to boost some posts on Facebook, which you can do that directly in your post that you create. There's like the boost button. And it's just gonna send that out to all your current followers to the front of their page. And you put that same money there and you'll have a higher conversion on that right now. So let's just start with that caveat before we jump down this pipeline. But now let's say I have the time,

Nick Clason (08:34):
Let, stop you for a second. Let's say like, let's talk about types of content. Like what do you mean by that? What are we looking for? Types of content wise to crazy question you say, make sure you have some, what is it like, maybe someone's sitting here thinking like, I, I might have some, but it depends. I'm not, I'm not exactly sure.

Matt Johnson (08:52):
Okay. So that's, we, we can really dive into that, but I would say if you don't have three pieces of unique content, don't run an ad. So, okay. We are currently running awareness ads for our church and we have nine pieces of video going out right now,

Nick Clason (09:08):
All at the same time. So

Matt Johnson (09:09):
All at the same time and they're all targeting different things and they're all being way differently, which, uh, we can kind of get into the nitty gritty of some. I can get into the nitty gritty of that. It's like actually showing how to set up an ad. I'll recommend some like videos you can watch to actually walk through that. Um, but I really cause it's hard on a podcast for me to explain, okay, you go here, press the plus button. You're like, what the heck are we talking about right now? So, um, but yeah, so have some unique content. So like a big example of this is like when we were trying to sell lead the cause at dare to share, we'd run nine videos, nine graphics and uh, um, like actual like, you know, a color background with words on it and then just nine photos. So just normal photos. Wow. I mean, that's, I mean, that's a different way to like, that's a lot of content to get, you know, a lot of people to sign up and sell out those events, which would work. So play that. So like I would recommend get one video, one photo and one graphic and that's gonna really help you start to experiment with this.

Nick Clason (10:14):
Okay. All right. Great. So that's, that's some of the content examples then what mm-hmm

Matt Johnson (10:19):
okay. So you have your content, you need to know what you're trying to promote. Okay. So you're trying to get people to come to church. Are you trying to get people to download your ebook? Are you trying to get people to register for alpha? Are you trying to get people to, um, you know, buy a shirt own? Yeah. Clarify your win.

Matt Johnson (10:40):
You need to know that cuz that's gonna depict. If you do an awareness campaign, a consideration campaign or a conversion campaign, and that's something you gotta define before you even start building, you know, your ads. So what's just start with the brand awareness, like an awareness campaign. So I want people just to know about my church and let's just for this example, say our church is life, church, not the actual life church, but we're just some subsid area of a life church in the middle of no. Okay. So we want people to be aware of life church. All right. So I'm gonna set up an awareness campaign with brand awareness life, church, and then the goal of that ad. So you're gonna have to choose like, okay, what is, what, um, what is like my target? What is my budget? And then you're gonna go, what is the goal? So pick your budget. I always do a daily budget when I do an ad and I always recommend start out about $10 a day. Okay. And you turn it off when you're ready to turn it off. So you don't need to spin

Nick Clason (11:45):
So you can run it. You can run it in perpetuity. You're saying mm-hmm if you can just keep running it mm-hmm okay.

Matt Johnson (11:53):
I

Nick Clason (11:53):
$10 a day to throw at it.

Matt Johnson (11:55):
Yeah. And then we turn off our ads. Once the conversion goes below what I want it to. So okay. When the ROI starts out, weighing it. So you'll go through and your name, your ad you'll schedule it out. But the big, next step is creating your audience.

Matt Johnson (12:11):
This is the most important part of your ad. So before you run your ad, you need to decide who am I targeting here? So, all right. We are, let's say we are life. Church is located in Phoenix, Arizona. I'm gonna target Phoenix, Arizona then. So you start with, okay, we're gonna target get Phoenix, Arizona. You're gonna pick the age. You're gonna pick like, uh, so let's say, okay, we wanna this let's say we're promoting something that's for young adults. So we would probably choose 18 to, you know, 40 year olds to come to this event. So I would target them specifically and Phoenix, Arizona. And then you can start like looking up interest and behaviors for them. So this is something that's recently just changed in Facebook in the last couple of months is you used to be able to like, uh, type in, oh, okay.

Matt Johnson (13:04):
Bible study in there. You can find people that have, you know, liked Bible study or Christian or whatever. So you could type in religious stuff. Facebook doesn't allow that anymore. So you're gonna have to get creative. So this is how, what we started doing, um, at dare to share. And then currently here we started thinking, all right, who, what do our people like around here? So one thing we started tar targeting was like coffee lovers. Okay. Um, is we know youth pastors love coffee. Uh, we started targeting here. This is a really funny one. Nick. I don't know if you can do it now. I'd have to double check with the new update, but we targeted skinny jeans so we started, you know, targeting people that were, were skinny jeans. Um, and you just gotta find the things that their interest in the behaviors that they all have in common as you're running the ad. So let's say Phoenix. Okay. We wanna target people that like maybe, uh, I'm trying to think of like, if there's any personalities that they even let do anymore, like they've changed it a lot. Uh, like you used to be able to like target over, Hey, you liked Lee Stroble.

Matt Johnson (14:11):
So let's do Lee stro, but you know what I just thought of what might be. Oh,

Nick Clason (14:23):
I'm sorry. Hello, Eleanor. Welcome to the podcast. We should add her as a, a host.

Matt Johnson (14:30):
A host. Yeah. Yeah. She, I think she she's pooping right now. Oh, oh. What? The life? Um,

Nick Clason (14:36):
That happens to me sometimes.

Matt Johnson (14:37):
Anyway. know. Uh, so let's say, uh, you think of a TV show that your congregation has all talked about or whatever. Like you can look it up for that TV. So, um, so you can like, you know, do detail targeting on that. Um, great. And then you'll do like, okay, let's how are we gonna place it? I always do like how Facebook would place it, cuz Facebook's algorithm is gonna weigh how it thinks it should. Um, and then you'll go to your next step. So does that all make sense so far before we move on to what's next?

Nick Clason (15:13):
Yeah. Yep. Sound good. So you're segmenting down your audience. Okay. You're choosing them. You're getting nitty gritty specific about what they are.

Matt Johnson (15:22):
Yep. Yep, exactly.

Nick Clason (15:24):
And then, um, do you need to go change a diaper so that we so that she does, so that you're good with that? Or do or can you keep plowing through

Matt Johnson (15:33):
Yes, I will. I will go change the diaper real quick. Okay. And Nick, you do some filler

Nick Clason (15:40):
Great off, off, I'll be right back off. He goes off our, our podcast marketing expert goes all right, great. So after some technical difficulties, Matt, what comes next?

Matt Johnson (15:51):
Yeah. So, uh, the next thing after you get your audience, you decide everything you're gonna do your ads. So you start naming your ads and this is where you make all your content. You set up your ads as image videos, carousel, collections, cetera. Um, and this is really where I want you the listener to get creative here. Okay. So this is where a copy. So all the words you write are gonna be super important. Um, cause you can do five variations of everything you write. And I say, do five variations, cuz Facebook will choose like their algorithm, which one's converting the best. That will become your number one. But so you don't wanna just do one variation there cause you're not getting Facebook any time to like learn. And this is also where you'll add in your other ad sets. So you can start doing, uh, the other videos.

Matt Johnson (16:49):
You maybe have other photos, graphic, whatever that looks like. So, and then we create five pieces of copy, five titles for each and get fun here. Like this is really where you should be testing out. Uh, okay, what are people gonna search or think, or what's gonna hook with them. So, um, and it's funny when I do this because I'll get so many messages from people around the church, like, Hey, uh, why am I seeing this version? And I was like, well, it's clearly, that's what your likes have. Uh, you know what Facebook has thought that you liked the most. And clearly it worked cuz you're texting me about it. Yeah. And you know, the other hunt, 99 things that go out a week, you didn't notice at all. So like that's so, um, yeah. Have fun with emojis in there. Fun titles, be funny, serious vision casting, whatever that looks like for your church. This is the time that you can start to really do it.

Nick Clason (17:47):
Okay. So build out. But, but when you do that, when you launch it, try to do that with a variety of different types of content, do some video, some static, post some graphic posts and is what you're doing is you're just kind of sending all of them out to Facebook to see which one performs the highest or are you letting all of them run? And then let's just say, this is your first time. Like what is a terrible like conversion? Like when is it like, okay or what's I guess maybe not even a conversion, but what is the sound? The alarms like hit the Jack button, don't run this ad anymore. It's a waste of your time, a waste of your money. Um, and what, when should they, like, this is the thing. And now with that, you should start over because it's not going well.

Matt Johnson (18:31):
Yeah. So, uh, Facebook will do something called free Facebook learning. So I wanna be clear like once you like post an ad, it's gonna take a couple, it usually takes about a day or two before the will start running. So just be that don't freak out. Yeah. Don't freak out and also triple check all your copy and all that stuff. Cause if you change anything, it goes back into Facebook learning. So you're like, oh crap, I did this or whatever. It's gonna have to go back and learn again. Uh, when it comes to hitting a jet, uh, that's really on you of what your budget is and your like what your goals are. But like I said, if we're over $4 on a person for a conversion, I hit check on it.

Matt Johnson (19:12):
OK. Um, honestly it's usually if it's above $2 for us at our current church, just cause you know, money is, uh, something that you have to be cognitive of. So yeah. Um, if we're under $2 on our ad conversion, then great. Like we will, uh, keep writing that ad and I'll pour gas on it is what I tell the that's taking off. Let's put another, you know, 500 towards it until it starts to not as well. And then when it stops converting, well you can, let's the, title's try the copy let's even, or the colors, the background. And then you get to the point where it's like, okay, this ads run its course and you take that audience so you can take that cold list and the audience you learn from and advertise with, to them for something whatever's next for you.

Nick Clason (20:01):
Mm. Okay. So let's pretend like for you and, and us, we've been, we're running ads now for a while. Mm-hmm uh, is $2 something that like you build up to, or is that like a pretty standard practice? Like even if you're brand new, um, you wanna try and shoot to be under $2?

Matt Johnson (20:20):
Uh, I would say shoot for under $4 right now. Like everyone try to shoot

Nick Clason (20:28):
Four and then maybe as you, as you do more of this and as you become more familiar with it, you might, you might be able to whittle that down. You're saying

Matt Johnson (20:38):
Y yep. Yeah, definitely.

Nick Clason (20:40):
Okay. So, so the, the, the experience and the more familiarity and the more volume that you do with it, like will hopefully help, help drive that down. So I just wanna be clear that people are like that $2. That's your benchmark, but you've been doing this and yeah, you're pretty advanced on it. So it's, it's, you know, that's not a starting spot necessarily.

Matt Johnson (21:03):
No. I mean, there's sometimes that like this for this audience, you know, I keep it her $4 or $2, but like, let's say you have a 300, 500 product. If you're converting at $10 a person at that point, like the ROI outweighs it, you know? So it really depends on the product. Sure. But, um, if you're running free ads for awareness and just trying to get people to go to your website, if you're over $4, like don't get eject there, you know?

Nick Clason (21:34):
Okay. So you're just kinda watching the dashboard. Now you're watching the conversion rate. You're seeing which one is converting. What, if anything is next?

Matt Johnson (21:47):
Yeah. So that, uh, really will, um, come down to what your strategy is honestly. So, uh, right now we run a monthly awareness campaign at our church. Um, and what I do is like, we wanna just build up our audience on our Facebook ads. And as we're about to launch our summer ebook, we'll retarget, all those people that might have watched our awareness ad with the conversion ad or an engagement ad now. Um, OK. So it's a good way to like get in your pipeline. So I would recommend like, Hey, run ads for, you know, a couple months before Christmas, even, and then like target everyone for Christmas time or trunk or treat or whatever that looks like for you. Like you have some options there. Um, and also like, okay, go ahead. Do you,

Nick Clason (22:38):
Do you, uh, go back into like, say ad number one and everyone who's become an audience member of ad, number one, do you say target this ad to them? Or like, how does that work? And I get it, I'm sounding like, I don't know what I'm doing, cuz I don't. So

Matt Johnson (22:55):
When you're staying

Nick Clason (22:56):
Retarget, what do you do? How do you actually like go to those people?

Matt Johnson (23:00):
So it's really built off your Facebook pixel, um, which that's becoming a, you know, a little bit of a issue with new privacy laws, but you know, right, right now you can still kind of use it and it's retargeting people as you're creating your audience, you can like say target my Facebook pixel through this time or whatever, which should, if it's an awareness campaign and they're going to whatever you're trying to do. It's like if they're, if you are doing awareness campaign and the whole point was for them to go to your website, mm-hmm or to just click on your Facebook page, your Facebook pixel will read that if you put your Facebook pixel in your website, you have it. If you haven't, I'll give you, we'll put a resource in the show notes about how you can do that. Super easy takes 30 seconds to do.

Matt Johnson (23:45):
Um, you can retarget those people, uh, cuz they would be a warmer lead for you. So you're targeting people that have essentially seen your ad at that point. Um, another thing um, you can do is like target people that have watched a video for a certain length. So, uh, that's why videos are really good. And we did a lot of that at dare to share like, okay, this person watched the video, we wanna only target people. I've watched this video for 30 seconds. OK. So we've run ads that were like, um, you know, 15 minutes long cuz we wanted people to watch as much as they could. So we target 'em different and Netflix does this sometimes and it's kinda rare. I haven't seen it in a little bit, but they used to run ads of full episodes of a show. Wow. On YouTube. So before YouTube, a video would start on YouTube, you could watch a full episode of like an example right now it's really big as the scene man. So like maybe sand man's episode, one would pay, play as a full episode and then Netflix can just retarget you over and over. Cause you watch an hour of their content. So they know this person's hooked.

Nick Clason (24:53):
Yeah. that

Matt Johnson (24:54):
Gotta get subscribe. So you can do that too. So you can get really creative with this stuff.

Nick Clason (24:58):
Mm interesting. Okay. But so then that audience just kind of like builds in that Facebook, the business Facebook like add place and you're just saying, okay, uh, send this ad to someone who watched a video for longer than 30 seconds or send this ad to person who engaged with our ad at such and such level. And you're doing that for, you know, so if you run a bunch of awareness adds, what you're saying is you can do a bunch of awareness ads and then once you get to Christmas, once you get to VBS, once you get to like your big event that you're actually trying to then go from like a awareness to like a conversion, you can start to specifically target those people be because in marketing words, they're warmer, they've engaged with you longer or at least at some level through previous ads. Okay.

Matt Johnson (25:48):
Yep. So a good example of this is like right now we're running an awareness ad. My goal is not like conversion rate on anything yet. Like how much it cost. It's just how many results people are we getting like to play our ad a week. And our goal is about 10,000 a week and we're hitting about 10,000 people. Every seven days are looking at our ads. And now that we're about to launch our fall ebook, we're gonna just retarget all those people that might have, you know, done a through play on our stuff to download the fall ebook.

Nick Clason (26:18):
OK. OK.

Matt Johnson (26:19):
So they're

Nick Clason (26:20):
Interesting.

Matt Johnson (26:21):
We're building trust. So the, I whole idea of your ad is to build trust with them and not to go back to the days of like commercials where it's okay. I'm just trying to get you to buy this product or whatever. Right. Like build trust with your audience. So give them a reason to wanna keep seeing your stuff.

Nick Clason (26:38):
Yeah. Yeah. Well it's like what we were talking about right. At the beginning, right? Like this isn't going from a a hundred people to a thousand people. You're trying to like yeah. Be a good mentor show, show them that your church is trustworthy and all that type of stuff. So. Yep. All right. Great. Um, anything else? Like that's a, that's uh, how to get it going, how to get it set up all those types of things. My audio cut out in the middle for half of it. So you were just flying solo and you didn't even know no.

Matt Johnson (27:06):
What are we missing?

Nick Clason (27:09):
Changing diaper. We had a very productive morning. Yeah. What's the last little bit of thing that, that the people need to know anything.

Matt Johnson (27:17):
Um, like go set up some ads for $10 a day, try a week out or whatever. Um, just go test it, watch some videos we'll put so a bunch of stuff in the show notes for you. And I also wanna be clear, like ads are changing constantly. Just like everything else that we've talked about. Like, you know, this is this week, next week. This could all just drastically change. Cause you know, Facebook just decides, Hey, this is what we wanna do now. You know? Or Google decides, oh, we're not doing it that way anymore. We're not gonna weigh our, uh, our Google ads as high. We're gonna go back to YouTube ads being weighed higher. There's always, you never know. So just keep that in mind too. So I'll even put into some resources that you can check in. Like what's most updated stuff for ads. So, uh, love it. We'll have a lot of, lot of stuff. This is definitely more techy and more of the technical side of everything we talk about on here. It's not philosophical at all. Yeah. So anyone can do it. You just gotta have patience and go test it out.

Nick Clason (28:18):
Yep. Love it. All right guys. That's it for today then? Uh, like and subscribe, give us a, uh, rating. If you found this helpful, please share it with a friend hybrid ministry.xyz online at hybrid ministry on Twitter and we will catch you next time.

Matt Johnson (28:38):
Bye guys.