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🕰️TIMECODES
00:00 Pro or Anti Lock-in?
02:16 The Argument Against Lock-ins
05:14 The Busy Youth Worker’s Guide to Social Media
06:12 The Argument For Lock-ins
09:11 What Do You do if Kids don’t like boardgames?
10:56 Are Lock-ins only effective for Middle Schoolers?
12:16 What are the “risks” vs the “rewards” of a lock-in?
14:29 Do Lock-ins affect your Sunday morning attendance?
16:43 The Final Argument FOR Lock-ins
18:00 The Final Argument AGAINST Lock-ins
19:09 You decide - who won?

--------------
TRANSCRIPT
Nick Clason (00:01.102)
Well, what is up everybody? Here I am this morning with Andrew and my new friend Ellen. Good morning everyone. How are we doing this morning?

Ellen Partridge (00:10.995)
Doing good.

Nick Clason (00:12.802)
Hey, are you guys, do you have coffee yet in your systems or is that long gone? All right, okay. They're doing pretty good, right, Michigan State?

Andrew Jansen (00:12.964)
Doing fantastic.

Ellen Partridge (00:16.771)
We're on the first cut. Go Spartans.

Yeah, not as good as Michigan, which is a bummer, but...

Andrew Jansen (00:23.46)
They're doing good.

Nick Clason (00:25.73)
Mm, yeah. And this will drop after March Madness, so we'll all know. Comment down below, like how Michigan did. know, Michigan State, not Michigan. But I'm excited because today we are debating pro lock-in versus anti lock-in. And based on the two people that you see on your screen here, you can probably already tell who's pro lock-in.

Andrew Jansen (00:33.591)
it.

Nick Clason (00:50.9)
and who's anti-lock-in. And so I'm just so excited for you guys to get to, not only get to know these two amazing people, but also hear their positions on this. And so by random draw that happened off screen that you're gonna have to trust me because I'm a pastor and I get paid to tell the truth. Ellen, you get to go first. So one minute on the clock for you. Just introduce yourself, help the people understand your context, where you're at, how long you've been in ministry, all these types of things. Ellen, are you ready?

Ellen Partridge (01:18.751)
Absolutely. I'm ready.

Nick Clason (01:21.58)
Alright, take it away.

Ellen Partridge (01:23.455)
All right, everyone, my name is Ellen Partridge. I serve as the central pastor of students at Thornton Apple Valley Church. We are centralized out of Hastings at Michigan, southwest Michigan. And we are a multi-site church, but I've been in ministry for very close to two decades now. And we're in a rural context and a multi-site context. So things are a little bit different for us versus just the single site.

And when I think about lock-ins, the thing that always comes to mind is the Halt analogy. If you're hungry, if you're angry, if you're tired, what are the things you shouldn't do, which is make decisions. And so we're gonna put students in a room where they are locked in together. You got the ones who, I have a kid in my youth ministry who at camp asked me if I could move our bedtime up to 9 p.m. I let him know that wasn't a thing, but you've got those kind of kids, and then you've got the kids who have snuck in.

all their energy drinks and are going to be up till four in the morning. And those kids that are up are going to be picking on the kids that don't want to be up, that want to be sleeping. And then you've got a lot of that interpersonal conflict that is going on within that. And you're putting that all into a giant space where you're having to entertain them and or keep track of them as they are, you know,

coming up with all of these grand ideas of how they're going to use their time. And I remember back to my youth group days, our youth ministry actually met in a old YMCA building, and for some reason, they did not lock the doors to the locker rooms, and then that locker room led to a empty pool. And I can't confirm or deny if there were children conceived in that pool, but there probably were.

And it was coming from opportunities where we did lock-ins and they let us all throughout this building with lots of classrooms, lots of spaces that should have been locked that were not. And so from that perspective of hungry, angry, tired, lack of ability to, you know, keep an eye on all the students and all the places, I am very anti-lock-in.

Nick Clason (03:43.896)
Well, there you go. Andrew, she blew past introductions just straight into arguments. Brother, she's coming for you, right? Like she is coming in hot. So, Ellen, great argument. Man, I hope no students, babies were conceived in that pool. I don't ever want to swim there. Andrew.

Andrew Jansen (03:49.24)
yeah, just right past it. Yeah, she went right past it and that's okay.

She's coming in hot, yeah, for sure. It's okay.

Ellen Partridge (04:10.12)
Me too.

Andrew Jansen (04:12.365)
Yeah, it's gross.

Nick Clason (04:13.838)
Tell us why Ellen's wrong and why lock-ins are a great idea. But first, give us a little bit of intro as you go. Are you ready, my friend? Let's go, take it away.

Andrew Jansen (04:28.345)
ready. Yeah, hit it. My name is Andrew Janssen. I am a middle school pastor in Manhattan, Kansas. Sorry, a couple years ago, we did play Michigan State and I know you probably knew that but we have nothing to talk about sports wise, hardly at all right now. So that's okay. But I love K State. I love serving in Manhattan. I am 36 years old. I've been a youth pastor for 10 years and

I really love getting to be in Manhattan, getting to work with college students that invest in middle schoolers. That's kind of my passion. And man, I love lock-ins. just, it works within the context of our church is about 1900 people and we work with multi buildings on our campus, but not multi-site, but.

It is just set up in a really easy way to execute and make lock-ins happen. And especially in our season right now where we have, and it changes, we have college students that graduate, but we have like 17, 18 youth coaches right now. And a lot of them enjoy staying up super late. And so it just really worked in this season to be able to have enough people there for a safe lock-in to happen.

Middle schoolers are crazy and love staying up all night, love getting to be like, you can be at the church besides Sunday and Wednesday. And just, it was just really, really awesome. We did a New Year's Eve lock in and they just have so much fun. There's opportunities for fellowship, board games, long extended times that maybe you don't get that opportunity to play through an entire game of exploding kittens or taco cat.

Mahomes cheese pizza, not taco cat goat cheese pizza. We all know Mahomes is the goat. But we play taco cat Mahomes cheese pizza and you get through two rounds and it's time for youth group to start. So we get to play through those games, have those conversations and invest in the students moving forward.

Nick Clason (06:40.494)
Great. All right, well there you have it. Like there's, each of you have laid down the gauntlet with your position, right? Andrews is based upon board games. Ellen's is based upon pools being present. And so with those two things in mind, plus everything else, do either of you have a question for the other that we can debate in a little bit more of an open forum?

Andrew Jansen (06:55.097)
You

Ellen Partridge (07:10.974)
All Andrea, I got one for you. So what do you do with the kids who are not your board game kids? What are your other activities that you're able to do? Because it sounds like you're pretty board game heavy. So how are you keeping the other kids occupied that are not interested in your board games?

Andrew Jansen (07:27.929)
Absolutely. I have, I try to make sure that every single second is accounted for at a lock-in. We have intentional time where it's like, they get to choose. We have our youth building has like carpet ball, foosball, ping pong. We have not a Nintendo switch too, but two Nintendo switches, which is kind of confusing, definitely. But so we have like Mario Kart and Smash Bros going.

Nick Clason (07:49.902)
That could be confusing,

Andrew Jansen (07:56.882)
I really try to get them away from screens as much as I can because we all know that battle. yeah, trying to have every single second with like some sort of activity, some sort of competition tournament. The last time I was on with Nick, we talked about the Assassin's like meta ongoing game that happens throughout the evening and having things like that where there isn't an opportunity to be bored.

really, really is effective with middle schoolers. Because once you were right, once they're bored and exploring and they find a pool and we know what happens next, like there's just something about an empty pool. So, but with middle schoolers, that's not so much like the sneaking off and having that happen. I think that's more of a high school situation, but I just try to make sure every single second is accounted for. And that kind of helps with, you know, not having that boredom.

board game time for the students that don't like board games.

Ellen Partridge (08:57.362)
And notice you keep saying middle school. You're not mentioning high school. So are you saying that lock-ins are only good for middle school or would you do one with high school?

Nick Clason (09:06.072)
Good question.

Andrew Jansen (09:06.325)
I would, that is a great question. I would do a, I would do a high school lock in for sure. I think that you do run that risk. They are a little bit more like, I can kind of put on the dad voice like the, Hey, what are you doing? And they'll just like freeze as a middle schooler. They still, you know, we'll listen to authority when it yells at them. So with high school, they're kind of a little bit more independent, a little bit more calloused and a little bit more.

Like on their own I consider I always use this analogy of like middle schoolers are like dogs and high schoolers are like cats Like dogs are just happy that you're there and happy that you see them high schoolers. You kind of have to earn that relational like equity and I would say yes have a lock-in with high schoolers, but only do it if you have the resources and the adult volunteers and also if you're like

this group is just like, this is a crazy group of high schoolers. It's not always a green light for that specific group of high schoolers if you just feel like that wouldn't be good. Does that make sense?

Ellen Partridge (10:16.934)
Yeah, it's good argument.

Nick Clason (10:18.464)
Andrew, you got a question for Ellen?

Andrew Jansen (10:22.763)
Yes, what do you feel is, like, I want you to tell me what is the, like, risk reward trade off where you feel like, hey, this is too risky to have a lock in for this type of reward.

Ellen Partridge (10:35.422)
Mmm.

Ellen Partridge (10:45.35)
Yeah, it's a great question. I would just say I'm a big fan of like doing late night activities, hanging out super late. The thing that gets me and where I feel like the risk comes in is once you hit that one, two, three, four a.m. that even, and you mentioned that you've got college leaders. I don't live in a college town and so I mostly have adult leaders. And so for me,

I know my adult leaders are not gonna be on their A game coming into that situation. And so for me, the risk in my context is a lot higher that my leaders are gonna start maybe losing their minds or going stir crazy or sleep deprivation is gonna kick in. And it's gonna lead to students, because they're curious, ending up doing things that they don't need to do. And so for me, I would rather do a thing where it's like, hey, we're hanging out till midnight. Your parents are picking you up.

and then maybe we do something again the next morning because then I know they're getting sleep, my leaders are getting sleep, and it also means that I'm not putting them at risk, I'm not putting my leaders at risk. And so for me, there doesn't seem to be necessarily, yes, there's the connection reward, but I wonder if that's always overshadowed by the sleep deprivation, the angry, hangry situations that can come up and also,

I worry for my adult leaders that they're gonna say something out of their own sleep deprivation or frustration after telling the same kid eight times not to do something, that it may end up ultimately hurting a relationship that was good, and then they make a good relationship with someone that they had a bad relationship with, and so you're kind of at a net zero, is kind of how I look at

Nick Clason (12:32.078)
I just feel like the ultimate fact that like, I would rather sleep in my bed at two o'clock in the morning. Like that's my strongest argument for anti-lock-in. Just shooting straight. Plus I enjoy Saturdays and if I am doing a lock-in, I don't know. Also, Andrew, question for you. Do you ever notice that your Sunday morning attendance is affected post a lock-in weekend?

Andrew Jansen (12:32.345)
Definitely fair.

Andrew Jansen (13:02.165)
for sure. I mean, I tell my youth coaches, like, hey, you were just at church for 15 hours. It's OK for you to sleep in. I'll be there because I work there. And students, a lot of times parents will bring them and they might fall asleep or something during a message.

Nick Clason (13:04.027)
hahahaha

Nick Clason (13:13.787)
Yeah

Yeah.

Yeah.

Nick Clason (13:28.622)
Yeah.

Andrew Jansen (13:29.079)
Yeah, think it happens. There are definitely repercussions to having a lock-in, but I just think that there's just a lot of... I've seen so many good things and good conversations and relationships start at lock-ins, and it's just with a certain unchurched group of students, it's just an easy invite. It's just an easy win to get them there.

Nick Clason (13:45.091)
Yeah.

Nick Clason (13:50.382)
Yeah, which and I hear you like Sunday morning, it's like, okay, like, yeah, they didn't come on Sunday morning, which is like the senior pastor's goal. But like we had a lot more effective and fruitful time than like them sitting through a sermon or whatever, like through the lock-in and you know, the times I have done lock-ins, like it's almost always one of the number one most attended events from friends. Like we get, we would have some of our biggest.

Ellen Partridge (14:12.242)
Mm-hmm.

Nick Clason (14:16.75)
numbers and biggest reach, you know, as far as outreach is concerned. So I definitely do see like both sides for sure. So those of you listening, you're about to get your opportunity to vote. Ellen, you went first last time. Andrew, we're gonna put a minute on the clock now for you. Give us your final one minute strongest argument why Y lock-ins. Are you ready, my friend? Take it away.

Ellen Partridge (14:30.173)
All right.

Andrew Jansen (14:42.008)
I'm ready.

Lock-ins are definitely the easiest first step in the door with a church. If you have the right resources, if you have the right volunteers, and you have a solid game plan going into it, you know your group of students. I think middle school or high school, it is an easy invite for the unchurched students. And that is kind of the lens in which I plan a lock-in.

I don't have the whole bait and switch. Like we're going to talk to them about Jesus Christ, their Lord and savior first thing, and then just have the rest of the lock in. It is, hey, building connections, being intentional and teaching the students. That's why we're doing this. Like, Hey, we're doing this so you can bring that friend, start that relationship. And so that they associate church with fun, with safe, with

They feel welcome and feel like they belong. There's something different happening here. And our hope is that continues on.

Nick Clason (15:47.81)
Great, almost a buzzer beater, but not quite. All right, Ellen, you get the final word, final say, anti-lock-in. Go ahead, take it away.

Andrew Jansen (15:50.839)
Almost.

Ellen Partridge (16:00.572)
All right, as fun as lock-ins can be in the memories that are made, the risk of students having bad memories, whether it's a leader who loses their cool, it's another student who says something they wouldn't have said because they're sleep deprived or because they're overtired, to me just doesn't equate to the reward. I am much more on the side of let's do a long.

evening event where maybe we can start at six or seven and parents are picking up at midnight. So we're still getting that opportunity to connect with them, to have those great conversations, to have an opportunity for them to invite their friends. But at the same time, when it hits two, three in the morning, our leaders and our students are home in their beds, getting the sleep and the rest that they need. And hopefully, because they had a great time.

We're gonna be able to see them on Sunday morning and they're able to stay plugged into that larger church community opposed from being just separate from the youth ministry.

Nick Clason (17:05.023)
Nice, nice. Another almost buzzer beater. Well, there you have it, my friends. You have your pro lock-in versus your anti lock-in debate. And so you guys get to be the decision makers. Those of you watching, let us know, comment down below. But without any further ado, we're gonna get out of here. For Andrew and for Ellen, I'm Nick. Thanks for watching everyone. See you next time.

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DESCRIPTION
In this video, a Gen-Zer shares their perspective on the future of ministry, specifically focusing on the concept of hybrid ministry. Exploring how technology and traditional practices can blend to create a more inclusive and engaging worship experience, this insightful discussion provides a fresh take on how ministries can adapt to meet the needs of the digital age. If you're curious about how the younger generation views the evolution of ministry, this video is a must-watch!

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📓SHOWNOTES
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🕰️TIMECODES
00:00 A Gen Zer's Take on Hybrid Ministry
01:30 What was your first impression of Hybrid Ministry?
03:01 Did it ever feel like we were trying too hard?
03:52 What has been your relationship with digital?
06:04 What did you think of all this hybrid?
07:08 After all this: Summarize your opinion
09:50 How Digital enhances in-person
12:56 What are the challenges of a Hybrid Space?
14:38 Does Editing Really Matter?
18:54 The Most Surprising Thing from the last year
20:42 The Final Word
--------------
✍️TRANSCRIPT

00;00;00;00 - 00;00;23;54
Nick Clason
Hey, what is up, everybody? Welcome to the Hybrid Ministry show. This is a fun, actually interview episode. So for those of you who have been watching following along over the last year or so, I've mentioned my resident, his name is Caleb. now a nickname. Call him flywheel. because he was in his residence, group Learning project, and he needed to read, from good to great.

00;00;23;54 - 00;00;42;15
Nick Clason
And he knew to read the flywheel chapter. And so I called him flywheel. and he now calls me Thunder Dog because I'm a Oklahoma City Thunder fan. but anyway, he's been with us for a year now, and I actually, I wanted to get his take, today, we actually said goodbye to him. we had, like, a breakfast at our house with him, my family.

00;00;42;20 - 00;00;56;20
Nick Clason
and so he's heading back home, but I want to get his take on what it was like, to work in a hybrid ministry environment. Like, you know, as a resident, you really get a lot of choices on that. And so, since he didn't get a lot of choices, I want to be like, hey, what do you think?

00;00;56;32 - 00;01;16;03
Nick Clason
What are you going to keep? What are you going to get go away from? and so I'm excited to have you kind of sit in on this interview, just conversation informal, him and I and just kind of his experience in this sort of hybrid space. So. Hope you enjoy. if this is helpful to you or anyone else that you might think, give it a like, give it a share.

00;01;16;18 - 00;01;21;23
Nick Clason
give it a subscribe. All those things are incredibly helpful to us. So without any further ado, the exclusive

00;01;21;23 - 00;01;24;25
Nick Clason
one and only Flywheel Caleb Maeda interview.

00;01;26;03 - 00;01;48;33
Nick Clason
Well, I'm here with Flywheel Maeda.

Caleb Maeda
Hey.

so I don't know, like, I don't know. You came into my world, and I told you that hybrid ministry, digital ministry, all that stuff mattered. so. So take us back.

00;01;48;35 - 00;01;53;40
Nick Clason
Take me back to when you, like, started with me at, like back in Chicago. Yeah. Well,

00;01;53;40 - 00;01;57;55
Caleb Maeda
yeah. So back in Chicago is like my first church job. Like in general.

00;01;58;50 - 00;02;11;09
Caleb Maeda
so I wasn't really sure how anything worked. So I think that really started, like, my mind set on, like, hybrid ministry because, like, I didn't have any previous, like, things I was holding on to, like, I had. youth group that I grew up in, but it was pretty different. And also coming out of like the pandemic. yeah. Like it like made sense. And then when I saw it working and like I saw because like the model that you guys used with like the connect groups that like, met in the homes and then watched it and like, interact with it. I thought that was like super cool. And so then also getting to like work on that show and like helped produce a little bit and like run some of this stuff like I like immediately saw the value and also like, like just being a younger person. Like I grew up watching YouTube like like the people that I like, loved growing up or like YouTubers and so like the value of that platform with this generation. I think I also kind of related to and so like from the get go, I was kind of brought in, I was like, yeah, this is legit, I agree. I mean.

00;02;58;06 - 00;03;03;59
Nick Clason
Did you ever, did you ever feel like, oh, these guys are trying to be YouTubers and they're old?

00;03;08;22 - 00;03;23;42
Caleb Maeda
No, because I think at the time it was honestly like the stuff that I was working on at Parkview is like the search for Chuck the duck that summer. And so, like, it was not stupid enough, but it was it was stupid enough that it was like these guys, like, they're clearly not doing this for clout. Like, I don't know any 30 year old man who's like, you know, it'd be really cool searching for a fake rubber duck for an entire summer, you know? And so I never I never got that kind of vibe just because of the nature of what we were doing.

00;03;35;15 - 00;03;42;54
Nick Clason
Yeah. Okay, so then you, after your time with us in Chicago, you go and you work at your home church for a little bit, right? And just interning? Yeah, mostly in the arena of worship.

00;03;50;12 - 00;04;05;10
Caleb Maeda
No, I was is youth for the first school year, and then it was worship the second school year. What was their relationship with digital social media hybrid? I mean, so they're they're your typical like evangelical covenant, like multi-site church. So they're like they're with it, but they're not sure

00;04;05;19 - 00;04;24;37
Nick Clason
I wonder how many evangelical covenant multi-site churches or like you say, typical.

00;04;24;12 - 00;04;38;10
Caleb Maeda
I actually don't know. It's a thing in Minnesota, I guess, from where I grew up. But, so they do have a value of social media, but they're not quite as consistent like they don't have, I don't think. And granted, when I was there, their social media platform was we didn't have students over Christmas break. So like, let's make something fun. And like that was it other than like announcements for events and stuff. Yeah. And now these days it's a little bit more like, you know, the trends where like, you see a guy, like, fall off a stretcher and then it's someone rolling and say, like, you should get to like, you know, those classes.

00;04;38;13 - 00;04;54;21
Nick Clason
I think you need only do some of this.

00;04;38;13 - 00;04;54;21
Caleb Maeda
I saw one the other day. We should do. but so like, they've started doing some more of that stuff in the past year or so. And so I think it's, it's done an uptick, but it's not as fleshed out as, like what we're doing here of like two posts a day, you know, that kind of, yeah.

00;04;54;26 - 00;05;18;11
Caleb Maeda
And they don't like a good day. Yeah. And they don't they don't do, like, fun content, like drafts or like things like that. The students other than, like pictures for, like recaps of events and stuff, they're not super on the pages. It's mostly like announcement based stuff. Yeah, yeah. Which like is a is a pretty like standard operating procedure for like churches and social media.

00;05;18;12 - 00;05;24;09
Nick Clason
Yeah. have a whole video linked right here about, you should also be posting announcements.

00;05;24;09 - 00;05;33;40
Caleb Maeda
You Should link to Parkview one to like, I only saw one at a time.

00;05;24;09 - 00;05;33;40
Nick Clason
I can only do one. We have it. We did it. We did.

00;05;33;40 - 00;05;36;36
Caleb Maeda
Really? Yeah. I didn't know that.

00;05;33;40 - 00;05;36;36
Nick Clason
I know you didn't. That's why you link to, like, three times in your last teaching video.

00;05;36;40 - 00;05;51;29
Nick Clason
Don't worry about this link to it here. This link I thought you could. You get one. You get one card per video. There you go. I didn't know that YouTube. I didn't know that one. I'm getting exposed right now. I thought I'd never mind. It's like we can talk about that later, but, Okay, so then

00;05;51;29 - 00;05;55;43
Nick Clason
then you come here and we are.

00;05;55;47 - 00;05;57;55
Nick Clason
What we're doing is very different.

00;05;57;55 - 00;06;09;14
Nick Clason
the Parkview one, by the way. I'll link it down in the description. You can watch it. It's like the 100th episode. 100th episode. How it all started. It's pretty pog. Yeah, I think it was a good one. It was a good one. but anyway,

00;06;09;14 - 00;06;12;23
Nick Clason
you come down here and it's different.

00;06;12;28 - 00;06;26;51
Nick Clason
Put it, put aside your people pleasing nature. Like, just give me the raw, unfiltered, like, what do you think?

00;06;26;51 - 00;06;48;29
Caleb Maeda
I mean, again, like, I, I agreed with what we were doing because I think of my experience at Parkview. I think for me, once we started doing or like trying to make students on the page more of a priority, that was kind of the shift that I was more on board with just because like, yeah, like the the one I struggled with the most were those like the no, it or not dancing TikToks that we did, I freaking I like I'm not a dancer, so I hated them, but like, I hated them cause I

00;06;48;29 - 00;07;14;43
Nick Clason
was not a dancer. Not for like strategy reasons. but once we started getting students on the page, I think that was where I started feeling like, yeah, we're doing something that, like, is cool. so yeah, yeah, that was kind of my first. So, you are heading, like off on your own at some point. At some point we don't know what's next.

00;07;14;48 - 00;07;37;26
Nick Clason
Yeah. But like, what are your thoughts on, like. All right, I'm about to be my own youth pastor, and I just did a, summer internship and then a full year long residency, with, church and youth pastors who are fully bought into, like, digital, like. Yeah. First of all, summarize your opinion

00;07;37;26 - 00;07;40;47
Nick Clason
like, you just you gave a lot of different like examples of like summarize like, yeah.

00;07;40;51 - 00;07;44;10
Nick Clason
Do you think it's like worth it valuable.

00;07;44;10 - 00;07;50;41
Nick Clason
And then like how would you yeah. How would you tell people like here's how it's working on

00;07;50;41 - 00;07;57;25
Nick Clason
like the inside of it because like, you know, if anyone follows me or listen to my stuff like they hear me reference it, talk about what we do.

00;07;57;25 - 00;08;00;45
Nick Clason
But like, you got to see, like, firsthand and like, just be honest.

00;08;00;45 - 00;08;05;52
Nick Clason
Like, are you like, I don't know, I don't know if it's working or not. Yeah. I mean, I think, I think the

00;08;05;52 - 00;08;25;31
Caleb Maeda
things that have been working the most has been getting students involved on the page, not even in terms of like on the page traction as much as like in person traction, because I think I think like with the social challenge that we did with the Hot Wings thing that we did like, it was a lot of kids saying like, hey, how can I be on screen?

00;08;25;41 - 00;08;38;03
Caleb Maeda
You know, this is what it was. It was how can I what can I do? Yeah. And like, well, that shouldn't be your only motivation to like, do these things. I think it lended itself great to increasing like the desire to like, serve

00;08;38;03 - 00;08;56;03
Caleb Maeda
or like well and like there, like you said, like what's normal to them. Yeah. Like and the option to like be on social media or be on YouTube is like a little bit, well, because like, I remember growing up and like seeing all my favorite YouTubers and thinking like, man, I wish I could do that, but I don't know how to do this.

00;08;56;03 - 00;09;24;01
Caleb Maeda
I don't know how to do this. And so I think it's a really great way for students to even live that little piece of them who, like, they don't know how to set up a studio. They don't know what lights are. Yeah, I don't know what that is. that's Jake. Yeah it is. Jake. Shout out to Jake I love you, but, like they it's it's an experience for them to get to like, live that out a little bit and then also do it in like a safe context where like, it's like, I don't know, it's safe for the family content.

00;09;24;01 - 00;09;39;47
Caleb Maeda
Like I think also just like the opportunity, the whole family. Yeah. It is like the opportunity to just like replace one video, I think in a kids feed is like a win in my opinion, because of just like the nature of social media, you know, like we can get into the whole of like comparing our lives and stuff.

00;09;39;49 - 00;09;48;01
Caleb Maeda
Yeah. Or like we can watch stupid people draft like, pizza toppings and pick Palios number one. Yeah. You know, was the decision ever I agree,

00;09;48;01 - 00;10;03;43
Nick Clason
okay. So off you go. Yeah. What's your what's your well what's your like as of today. Date of recording all that stuff like. Yeah. What do you think your future relationship with like digital and hybrid is going to I obviously yeah.

00;10;03;45 - 00;10;23;16
Nick Clason
You you don't know where you're headed like I guess pie in the sky. Like what would be the hope. The hope would be to recreate this just in the north? yeah. Like I said, like, I, I think that what we're doing is working. I think, again, like, I don't think it's as much about the followers on the page.

00;10;23;16 - 00;10;44;22
Nick Clason
It's more about what we're seeing in the room, you know, like, even like just seeing some of the kids drafting against each other and like, the relationships that are getting built, like, even within that, like you're getting pairs of, like two students who, like, wouldn't typically talk to each other and now they're being forced to like, draft something and like, communicate and like that can make them walk away with some form of connection.

00;10;44;27 - 00;11;09;27
Caleb Maeda
And so I think those are the things that I like about what we're doing. and so I would definitely want to, to create something like that. That's like students on the page driven. Yeah. where it's all about like it's a tool to use that to build community at our, at our group. Yeah. I mean, I think like the way that I've laid out because like, what you're talking about, even two is like, your strategy is like coming at it from like a different even angle.

00;11;09;27 - 00;11;37;57
Nick Clason
Yeah. So like my strategy is like, do fun and silly and stupid content to like, just get on people's feeds and get their attention. Yeah. Maybe you guys have a follow, maybe like start showing up more and more in their algorithm. Yeah. Then sprinkle in teaching content things that like are meaningful and spiritual and whatever, but then have that push them then further down the funnel to like our long form video on YouTube, which then always has like a next step.

Caleb Maeda00;11;55;49
Nick Clason
Yeah. Well and then like also being able to use the YouTube kind of like we did literally like on Sunday where we took the QR code to the baptism series and like that's how we're pushing kids to baptism now as they can go through that class. Like I think having that as also like a resource page on top of the other benefits has been really cool.

00;11;55;54 - 00;12;32;18
Nick Clason
Yeah. But it's like, I guess what's interesting is like how you're saying, like, you see the value of digital and how it plays in the room even, you know, and like, yeah, that's a different benefit than I often even talk about. Yeah. On here. Right. Like I'm always just saying like online to like walk down the funnel, but like you're saying like even if that doesn't happen, like our current pool of students that exist, like we see them interacting and engaging with us because like, yeah, I think a lot of times digital is a process for like how to reach outsiders.

00;12;32;23 - 00;12;53;42
Caleb Maeda
And you're seeing it as like, yeah, but also it can yeah, increase the experience for insiders. Yeah for sure. And like also like I mean it's also a great like invite way because you can be like, hey, the friend from school that doesn't typically go to church. When I come to church to try to be in a YouTube video, like that's also like a it's like it's multifaceted.

00;12;53;42 - 00;13;13;01
Caleb Maeda
You can use it for a lot of different things. Yeah, yeah. What are some of the or have been some of the challenges of being on the or in the hybrid culture, like what has been asked of you? That has been I think it's just like the time it takes to edit videos takes away from other things that you can do.

00;13;13;05 - 00;13;39;12
Caleb Maeda
and like, like obviously having a team like once we got, you know, the interns kind of cooking on drafts and stuff that lighten the load. But I felt like the first half of my residency, I would come to who's who's. Yeah. So undrafted. But yeah, but I feel like my first chunk of my residency was I would show up and I would edit and like, that was what I did, which like, good because now I can edit and like it's a skill that I can market in the future for non-church related products hiring.

00;13;39;21 - 00;14;02;51
Caleb Maeda
But yeah, shout out, please help me. but so I think that phone number down in the appreciate it. Yeah, yeah. 13 of our viewers I'm poor please. My Venmo is somewhere. Yeah, yeah. But, I think that that was tough for me for a little bit just because also, like, I'm just a relationally driven person. And so like the moments like even in the office that like, Drive Me are like the conversations that I'm having with people.

00;14;02;51 - 00;14;18;38
Caleb Maeda
Yeah. And so I think that was a struggle or at least an adjustment period. But also it was interesting because I went to college for music, but since it was a liberal arts school, I took a couple film classes and I like Learn Premiere in those classes already and so on. I came down here and you're like, yeah, we're going to be editing in premiere.

00;14;18;38 - 00;14;42;48
Caleb Maeda
I was like, I know ripple, delete. I can kind of do that. And so teach people. It was a little bit of like a mixed bag of like adjustment, but also familiarity at the same time. and also just kind of like reprioritizing my schedule to see, like where things fit

00;14;18;38 - 00;14;42;48
Nick Clason
does, does editing matter in your opinion?

00;14;42;53 - 00;15;07;12
Caleb Maeda
yeah, I think it does. I think. Actually, I don't I'm not sure. I think it does. I think in, in terms of, like grabbing attention, like the fastest way to make your content more appealing without adjusting your content is just in the editing. Yeah, but you can you can make a highlight reel of, like, any NBA player and make them look good.

00;15;07;12 - 00;15;39;08
00;14;18;38 - 00;14;42;48
Caleb Maeda
Same with like a YouTube video. Like if you've done rumors of Patrick Williams of Thunder, I really I was watching like a highlight video. I was like, this guy is as good as. Yeah. And so like, I think I think from like, like the, the online perspective of it and also like engagement in the room. Like I think back to when I was a student, if you showed me this like super yellow grainy video with like the white noise in the background, that's like almost as loud as this being, like, I would disengage almost immediately just because like, oh, this is an old video, I don't care.

00;15;39;12 - 00;15;54;56
Caleb Maeda
And so I think that there's that kind of like the production value does serve a purpose, but I think that I think we can get in the weeds a little bit like for our person just because like where the yeah, where the people who are like are doing the editing. So we're like, I hate that I did this and no one would even notice.

00;15;55;09 - 00;16;10;52
Nick Clason
Well, what we're talking like yesterday on stage, like the video on the, photo back to. Yeah. Like you and I could see the, like. Yeah. That the edge was a little bit. Yeah, yeah, yeah. On screen. But yeah, I don't know. But nobody noticed that before I pointed it out, I don't know, I wasn't paying. Oh not right.

00;16;10;55 - 00;16;27;02
Caleb Maeda
Probably not because you didn't spend very much time on that. Yeah at all. But then like I said look you noticed that. Then there's the little thing. And like, that's just part of, I think, being an artist because like, you're never going to be perfect at your craft and like, filmmaking and editing is like an art form. Yeah.

00;16;27;06 - 00;16;43;45
Caleb Maeda
Not to get all weird about it, but like, it is. And so, I think also just like not getting caught up in that, I think is important because there is a level of production value that is valuable. But I think, you know, any time we get so caught up in the production value that we're not thinking about the content, I think that's where we're going to fall into things.

00;16;43;45 - 00;17;01;32
Caleb Maeda
So at the end of the day, we should be delivering good content to our kids because that's what we're here for. Yeah, I agree, but reach out to either of us if you need anything. Yeah, please. Haha. Well, aim for real. Like how much? And our lives changing. Yeah, that's also true dude. Also like starry I'm going to talk about stars.

00;17;01;36 - 00;17;18;05
Caleb Maeda
Shout out to starry. I freaking love this dude and I've never even talked to him. I remember I started when I was doing the Hot Wings video. I started talking to him just like before the videos, just like, hey man, houses are gone. I love you bro. Yeah. And like, like just the ideas you need to build that connection with a dude in India is really cool.

00;17;18;05 - 00;17;31;13
Caleb Maeda
Yeah. And like, you would tell me some of the things that he would say back in like, I don't know, it was just really cool to like, build that with a dude I've never actually spoken to. And the only reason that happened was because we got to a point where, like, we need someone to help us edit and we found a dude on Fiverr.

00;17;31;13 - 00;18;02;09
Nick Clason
Yeah, yeah, yeah, don't don't tell Fiverr that we don't. I mean, to them we didn't we met him through the Google. We so so yeah. interesting. there's a lot, a lot more ministry opportunities, I think, from this than I thought there would be going into it because I thought, I thought that like, like on paper, it sounds like the ministry we're doing is we're doing it for online kids to get connected to church, to hopefully eventually come and then for our kids to have, like, content.

00;18;02;09 - 00;18;23;03
Caleb Maeda
Right. But then there's like the editor who's like discovering Christianity for the first time and like asking questions and stuff. There's like the community that's being built on, like the key kids who are like trying to do the drafts, like all of that extra stuff is stuff that I didn't personally like, think about. And then when I started seeing it like those ended up being the reasons that like, drove me to keep going rather than just the content.

00;18;23;08 - 00;18;46;56
Nick Clason
So what do you what do you think it will look like for you in the future, like because, you know, keeping going, whatever. Like you're quasi being forced to because you're like working and like this is what we're telling you, like, hey, you have to do. But like, yeah, soon you're going to be your own youth pastor working somewhere or for someone or whatever.

00;18;46;56 - 00;19;08;21
Caleb Maeda
Like what? What things do you see yourself? Just like taking most of all of it, honestly, like the the short form, I think that was the other thing. When I came in, I wasn't as big on short form videos as I was the long form videos, just because when I grew up watching YouTube, YouTube was long form videos.

00;19;08;25 - 00;19;28;49
Caleb Maeda
and so taking that and I just look at our, our Instagram reels, it's like, I know, dude, it's friggin nuts. But, yeah. And so I think I'll take a lot of that stuff, especially because, like, it's pretty easy to get a lot of content, like on a Wednesday night, just like sit down with ten kids and you can get like 5 or 6, you know.

00;19;28;54 - 00;20;02;03
Caleb Maeda
And so I think that and I also I think the, the teaching videos stuff, because the there have been a couple churches that I've been looking at, and like their social media is good, but like they just clip their live preachings, which I think is awesome and great and like, that's better than nothing. But I also think that there's something about, the way that we change it for In the Room versus the, the video that I think just makes the video work a little better because we're specifically crafting that part of our message for that medium.

00;20;02;08 - 00;20;31;21
Caleb Maeda
and so I think more work, it's more work, but I think that the payoff is great because also then, like, there's not like the room awkwardness, like there's not the like, con response. And then that frees us up for in the room to do things like table talk and all of that stuff. and also like, just like having your message written down in that form for the long form videos, helps you to say things that I think sometimes, like, I will drop in the room like there's if there's a little fun tidbit that, like, just isn't going to fit in the room, but I really liked it.

00;20;31;21 - 00;20;52;40
Caleb Maeda
Like, I have to say it in the the long form YouTube video. So I think that there's also that kind of added value. But anything else I can think of, probably like, honestly, I probably won't be on the student ministry page as much as I was at the beginning of this. But like, I'm trying to figure out how what does it look like to start this?

00;20;52;40 - 00;21;16;41
Caleb Maeda
Because like I can say on paper, I want all kids to be doing all the drafts all the time. Like if the kids are involved in like, how am I that, you know. Yeah. And so and sometimes it's helpful for them to like see examples. Yeah. And so it's kind of that like that I'm going to try to figure out how to balance that line of like setting the tone but like making sure it's, it's kid first.

00;21;16;46 - 00;21;34;25
Caleb Maeda
and then also like I think finding ways to like do like not only the teaching videos, but like the baptism videos, like courses like that. I think I would also want to pull just because like, I think that that's a great resource page for them that we can pull from. For anytime a kid has questions about baptisms, you can throw them to that.

00;21;34;30 - 00;21;53;32
Nick Clason
yeah. Yeah. And like, you know, you can also expand that. Like, you could even make the workshops that we've been doing into little video series, like, I don't know if there's like a lot of stuff that you can do with playlists and like with. Yeah, having the idea of it being like a course like. Yeah. And like you and I have talked about this a lot, but I think like content for content delivery.

00;21;53;32 - 00;22;09;26
Caleb Maeda
I think YouTube is a better way than live preaching just because like and like again, you've talked about this all the time, but like, I don't know anybody whose primary like learning style is sit down and listen to a lecture for 30 minutes even. You can have the best graphics as you want, like you can have great table talks.

00;22;09;26 - 00;22;27;14
Caleb Maeda
Like I'm not going to pull as much from that as I will from like a ten minute YouTube video with like graphics and like, I don't know, there's just something about the way our brains are wired with our shorter attention spans. I think YouTube is a great medium medium for content delivery in a way that like, we're not getting as much in the room.

00;22;27;16 - 00;22;50;28
Nick Clason
Yeah, I think these days. Yeah. And I mean the again, sky's the limit. Creativity like your, your creativity or lack of creativity is you're like lid on it. So like if you have like a system like we do now where it's like you fill all your messages and everything, like you know, you can at any time play the video that, yeah, the live teaching doesn't work.

00;22;50;33 - 00;23;12;53
Nick Clason
You can play the clips or like, yeah, like we're going to be gone. We were gone for like a conference earlier this year so we could just throw the video up there. Well in like next week we're gone for camp. Yeah on a Sunday. And so your video is broken up into four parts. Yeah. Questions thrown in like so that I can literally hand it off to any volunteer pastor that's back here on staff.

00;23;12;53 - 00;23;34;58
Caleb Maeda
And they can do it pretty seamlessly. Like, yeah, like, yeah, the sky. And that's the thing, if you say learning happens better in like a medium like that, like almost makes you wonder and ask yourself like, how do I, how do I create a hybrid moment between the two? Like I live in the room and like a video.

00;23;35;02 - 00;24;08;05
Caleb Maeda
Yeah. Where like, intersects and is like used strategically for, like a students most optimal way of learning. Yeah. So yeah, I don't know, I think it's, I think it's something that like we haven't tapped into more from like tradition and anything. And I think that school is starting to go this way a little bit like you've heard of like the flipped classroom where they like get a video and then they watch the video at home, and then they do their homework in the classroom, and then they, like, talk to the teacher and work it out in the classroom.

00;24;08;05 - 00;24;38;27
Caleb Maeda
But all of the teaching is done at home through videos. Yeah. And so I think that, like, we're starting to see that shift in like the school realm. And so I think that church should be the next step. just because I think they like I've, we've been saying like, I think it's a much more effective way to deliver content to this generation, because also, like when I think about it, like I can list, you know, a couple topics from like sermons that I've listened to, but like fallout YouTube videos right now that I've been watching, like, I can pull a lot more purely from just like the amount that I can consume in a

00;24;38;27 - 00;25;00;26
Caleb Maeda
sitting. Yeah. You know, like I can consume 30 minutes. Yeah, I can consume 30 minutes of YouTube content more effectively than in the room for, you know, all of those reasons. Yeah. Yeah. So all right well that's it man POG signing out. Score Vikings. Thanks for hanging some video. I'll probably be here on the screen. Yeah. Click it watch it.

00;25;00;26 - 00;25;04;35
Nick Clason
Do the thing. See you next time. Love you stay hybrid. Yeah. Nice.

00;25;05;36 - 00;25;08;28
Nick Clason
I gotta pee. Okay,

00;25;09;49 - 00;25;13;02
Caleb Maeda
Oh.

00;25;13;24 - 00;25;18;35
Nick Clason
I can't wait to hear that. Nice.